Yeah Imagine

Hey! I was wondering if there is actually any evidence for Paul Mc. actually really liking Two of Us -- everything I found was an Aidan Quinn interview in which he mentioned he met Paul and asked him if he liked it and he said yes. It's just that the way everyone says it, it makes it seem like he loved it, when in reality maybe he was just being nice? Is it a meme I am not aware of? Help.

Hi! :) The answer is yes, Paul does genuinely like Two of Us (2000)! I think he's been asked about it in a few interviews but the one I specifically remember was on the Adam Buxton podcast in 2020 (it's episode 144 around the 50 minute mark if you want to listen to it yourself). Here's what Paul said:

I did see [Two of Us] actually, yeah. And what was OK about that was that at the beginning of the film it said, you know, 'John and Paul met on such and such a date in New York and this is us imagining what might have happened.' It's pure fiction. They did it like a disclaimer at the front. So I thought, well, that's OK. 'Cause I can get into this. And I mean, I must say, I enjoyed it. I thought, 'I wish that had happened.' [Laughs] It didn't happen quite like that.

So yeah, basically Paul is an RPF understander and enjoyer. An open-minded king!

Ok, we’re used to the eye f*cking on stage, but this is on a whole new level.

Wish they had kept this in the video.

What opportunities did we allow to flow by, feeling like the timing wasn't quite right?

What kind of magic might have worked if we had stayed calm?

Couldn't I have given you a better life?

- This One by Paul McCartney.

‘(Forgive Me) My Little Flower Princess’ was written during John Lennon’s stay in Bermuda, from June to July 1980, and recorded upon his return to the studio, on 14 August 1980. It wouldn’t be heard by the general public until 23 January 1984, on the posthumous album Milk And Honey.

The lyrics go as follows:

Forgive me, my little flower princess For crushing your delicateness Forgive me, if you could forgive me

Forgive me, my little flower princess For selfishness Forgive me, forgive me

Well, I know there is no way to repay you Whatever it takes I will try to The rest of my life I will thank you Thank you, thank you, my little

If you’ll forgive me, my little flower princess Never too late unless you can’t forgive

Time is on our side Let’s not waste another minute ‘Cause I love you, my little friend I really love you

Give me just one more chance And I’ll show you Take up the dance where we left off The rest of our life is the, my little

I’m home

Overall, the song seems to strike the same apologetic tone previously expressed in ‘Jealous Guy’ (1971) and ‘I Know (I Know)’ (1973).

I didn’t mean to hurt you I’m sorry that I made you cry Oh no, I didn’t want to hurt you I’m just a jealous guy 

— ‘Jealous Guy’ (1971)

I know what’s coming down and I know where it’s coming from and I know and I’m sorry (yes I am) but I never could speak my mind

— ‘I Know (I Know)’ (1973)

“The rest of my life I will thank you” gives a sense of gratitude for the other’s love and presence in his life, further explored in ‘Now And Then’ (1978). 

I know it’s true, it’s all because of you And if I make it through, it’s all because of you And now and then, if we must start again Well we will know for sure, that I love you

— ‘Now And Then’ (1978)

“Take up the dance where we left off” shows hope in a reconciliation that they have “the rest of our life” to experience, as found in ‘(Just Like) Starting Over’ (1980) and ‘Grow Old Along With Me’ (1980).

It’s been too long since we took the time No-one’s to blame, I know time flies so quickly But when I see you darling It’s like we both are falling in love again It’ll be just like starting over, starting over

— ‘(Just Like) Starting Over’ (1980)

Grow old along with me The best is yet to be When our time has come We will be as one God bless our love

— ‘Grow Old Along With Me’ (1980)

Nevertheless, this feeling that “time is on our side”  doesn’t take from the urgency to get together and “not waste another minute”, similarly dealt with in ‘Borrowed Time’ (1980) and ‘(Just Like) Starting Over’ (1980).

Now I am older ah, hah The future is brighter and now is the hour 

— ‘Borrowed Time’ (1980)

It’s time to spread our wings and fly Don’t let another day go by my love

— ‘(Just Like) Starting Over’ (1980)

Regarding the endearments used during the song, we find the classical ‘little friend’, famously used by aunt Mimi in reference to Paul. (It is also worth noting that, tongue-in-cheek or not, in French ‘petit-ami’ means boyfriend). 

Also, the song is called ‘My Little Flower Princess’. It is known that Yoko Ono has reported hearing Paul being called ‘John’s princess’ around Apple.

But it’s John’s thing with flowers as a metaphor for love that fascinates me the most. 

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do you have any theories about the india trip ?? personally, im not sure what to think about it, but i’d love to hear your thoughts !!

(Sorry its taken me so long to answer this - it just got lost in my drafts cause im an idiot lmao 🤦‍♀️)

Im not entirely certain on what I believe happened in India, if in fact anything did happen at all - but more on that later! I guess though that these are the main theories (though if you have any differing opinions/theories, feel free to discuss them!):

1. Paul rejected John’s advancements

2. John wanted to further their relationship, and Paul wanted to maintain the ‘friends with benefits’ situation they already had

3. Nothing significant happened between the two (yet something still changed in John)

I’ll try to discuss which theories I find the most convincing, compelling and substantiated - as well as offering my own opinions and hypothesis’s ^^ (discussion bellow the cut)

1. Paul rejected John’s advancements

The theory I would say im most drawn to - not the theory that im necessarily most convinced by though - is that John made a move on Paul, after a few years of pining for him, and was subsequently rejected. Its a theory that I tend to be compelled by, but I have to admit that its one I struggle to justify entirely. The problem with this theory, for me, is that this is a conclusion ive drawn based mostly off of what their relationship appeared to look like after India. It seems as though something must have happened between them to have ruptured their relationship as profoundly as it did - and because they were on relatively good terms before India*, combined with certain inferences we could draw from comments John made regarding his feelings towards Paul and their relationship, it feels as though it’s possible that he made an advance on Paul, which was rejected and thus caused the ultimate disintegration of the Lennon/McCartney relationship.

(*I mean, their relationship was always complicated and difficult - but it seems that it was okay-ish prior to India, and then just inexplicably plummeted after the trip)

But nobody (as far as im aware) has confirmed, or even really alluded to, this advancement or rejection ever having happened. And the lack of evidence substantiating the claim is a major draw back for me!

However, I do also feel as though nobody’s really come out about anything that happened in India - all ive heard is that they meditated, wrote songs, John and Cyn fought, and Ringo ate baked beans. But like, more must have happened on the trip, surely? Im not saying the absence of information regarding the trip is proof that there was a big “lovers quarrel” between John and Paul, and that everyone involved in that trip is now just sworn to secrecy or something - but like, id just like to see a biographer really investigate the holiday, and try to conclude what events might have occurred during the trip, because as of right now, with the information we have, it seems to have been, bizarrely, both a lacklustre and uneventful, yet still hugely impactful event. If the narrative of the “India trip” were to be shifted in the future in light of new information, the same way the narrative of “Let It Be/Get Back” is being changed, I wouldn’t be surprised!

2. John wanted more, but Paul didn’t

Another popular theory is that John and Paul were engaged in something of a physical affair, but in India John proposed (or perhaps demanded even) that they take their relationship further, and Paul just wasn’t compelled to do so.

Beliefs vary regarding this, based on how far you personally think their relationship went: some might say they only ever did a little drunken experimenting with one another, and that it was just a fun fling until John suggested they take it further. Others might argue that they were in fact in a committed relationship, and John wanted to go public with it - or at the very least, demanded exclusivity between him and Paul.

In entertaining this theory, im most compelled to believe that John and Paul were engaged in occasional “flings”, and perhaps by ‘68 were even acknowledging that there was some deeper and more sincere between them - but ultimately, I don’t think Paul would have ever been inclined to fully commit to John, because I think he always wanted children and a family. In addition to this, though its clear John and Paul were passionate about one another, it isn’t clear how compatible they were in the long term - and with Paul being the more grounded of the too, I suspect he would have recognised this incompatibility, which John (the idealist) might not have.

Though I admit that John could certainly be unrealistic and irrational, im not convinced that he suggested to Paul they go public with their relationship, because I think John still had a fairly strong sense of his place in popular culture, and would have still been able to recognise that if they were to “come out”, it would probably deeply and irreparably damage both their careers - as well as George and Ringo’s too - at least amongst the general public. They’d still have some ardent fans, but their following overall would have become far more niche, and the “beatlemania” would’ve worn off swiftly. Im not sure if either of them would’ve been willing to take that heat in ‘68, especially not Paul, who as I mentioned earlier, I think might have recognised the futility and incompatibility inherent in their relationship.

Then again though, John was always a little “cocky”* when it came to his sexuality - I think if an interviewer were to genuinely have enquired into his sexuality, straight up asking him “Are you bi? Gay?” I get the sense that he would have told us! Sure he’d probably have dressed the response up with a dozen quick quips and jokes, but ultimately, I think he would have given a sincere response. And so, perhaps he did feel he had the confidence, at least in India, to actually “come out”, but if Paul wasn’t willing to make this official with him, perhaps this confidence dissipated.

(*No pun intended you pervs🤦‍♂️)

Another thing to note about India is that they’d have been relatively secluded, as well as off the drugs/drinks for the most part - and this would have forced them to really reflect upon their relationship. Perhaps John saw that he wasn’t contented with Cynthia, and recognised his desire for more from Paul - and so in such a raw state of mind, I can see how he’d become so shattered if Paul were to have rejected him (that statement could relate both to the first and second theory, I feel). Perhaps John made an advance upon Paul whilst they were both sober for the first time, and that changed their relationship somehow? Just thinking out loud here!

But again, this theory overall has the same problem as the first in that, though it appears to make sense, it still lacks proof; it ultimately isn’t a substantiated claim.

3. Nothing happened between J&P, but something changed

This is probably the theory that everybody is least interested in hearing, but I still think its a pretty valid one, albeit the least dramatic (In my opinion though its still a really interesting perspective to explore though!).

Its possible that nothing of particular significance happened in India, but something still shifted in John, causing him to vilify and reject Paul. The issue with this though, is that it begs the question: why did John undergo such a significant change in India then?

Id argue that perhaps John was making very subtle and slight moves towards Paul, that Paul either ignored or didn't pick up on. Id assume that perhaps John had been hinting at this desire for awhile now, and maybe he got it into his head that in India, where him and Paul would have a lot of time to be alone and intimate, his feelings would finally be reciprocated. But then, Paul never picked up on these hints, and never made any advancements - and this broke something within John. It would fit neatly within the Yoko narrative, because it offers reasoning to the abrupt but intense attachment John formed towards her almost immediately after India - as well as explaining the sudden vilification of Paul. But I suppose that the first two theories also fit pretty neatly within the Yoko narrative, because they all relate to the same basic concept that John wanted more from Paul, and Paul didn’t - and so he tried to replace him with Yoko.

I suppose though, that the this theory overall could also be countered by making the argument that Paul also began to spiral after India, and so some occurrence presumably must have happened to Paul too. I wonder though if its possible that maybe Pauls spiralling was kind of a result of Johns? I get the sense though that Paul would need a change in his life to cause his mental health to seriously deteriorate, but I don’t feel like the same is necessarily true for John - I think John is sort of the type to spiral, irregardless of whether his life undergoes a significant change or not, because I think John was the force driving a lot of the drama and troubles throughout his lifetime. So if Johns mental well-being started seriously deteriorating, I can see this being a cause of panic and anxiety for Paul.

But something that further inclines me to believe that an actual event occurred between John and Paul is this extract from Geoff Emmericks memoir (x)(id recommend reading the entire extract, its interesting!):

‘I glanced in Paul’s direction. He was staring straight ahead, expressionless and weary. He didn’t have much to say about India that day, or any other. I sensed at that moment that something fundamental in them had changed.”’

It just really feels as though there was some confrontation between John and Paul that had to have happened to perpetuate the miscommunication later seen between them. Like if there hadn’t been some kind of confrontation, then I can’t really understand why Paul would be reluctant to speak about India, or harbour any regrets or dismay regarding the journey. Perhaps you could drill it down to the betrayal they appeared to have felt by Maharishi allegedly hitting on girls - but I feel like this was a “betrayal” mostly felt by John, I never really got the sense that Paul was deeply effected by it.

But yeah - those are the main theories I think.

Overall, I think that the third theory is probably the most substantiated claim, but I think it leaves a lot to desired. It just doesn’t feel like it totally fits together, as though theres more to the story - but I guess relationships and peoples psyches aren’t puzzles, and so not everything is always going to piece together perfectly; but I dunno.

Like I said though, the theory im most compelled by is the first. I acknowledge that it lacks evidence, but it just seems to make a lot of sense to me! But really, who knows what the hell happened in India?

If anyone else has an opinion on all this, or wants to expand upon or even suggest a new theory, feel free to! I always like hearing from you guys!

Honestly, forget about India. I need to know in detail what occurred on that New York trip if we’re getting headlines from 1968 magazines like this:

𝑰𝒛𝒛𝒚 𝑺𝒕𝒓𝒂𝒅𝒍𝒊𝒏♡

𝒂𝒌𝒂 𝒕𝒉𝒆 𝒍𝒐𝒎𝒍>

John: Uh, this is John Lennon talking to you from the heart of the West Side of New York in an interview exclusive — full interview — with brand new New Yorker Sean Ono Lennon, spelled S-E-A-N. Okay? Now tell me Sean, what’s your first impression of New York? Sean: [Baby noises] John: I see. 

An interview John did with his son, Sean, circa 1976. The Lennon family had just gained permanent residency in New York. Sean had been born October of the year prior. I apologize for the background music - I didn’t add that. My favorite quotes/partial transcript:

John: I was wondering if the fiscal crisis of New York had any — 

Sean: [Baby noises]

John: Uh-huh, that’s the one I was talking about, yes.

Sean: [Baby noises]

John: Exactly!

[…]

John: I see you know which subjects to avoid and which not to. Very sensible. Must be running for office, is that what it is?

Sean: [Baby noises]

John: It is exciting, isn’t it? And such a strain on the - on the old ticker. [Laughs]

[…]

John: Oh, he’s smiling, folks. 

John: [Very softly] Perhaps you’d like to tell me your favorite color?

Sean: [Baby noises]   

John: That’s not good enough, I’m afraid.

Sean: [Baby noises]   

John: [Normal voice] No interesting color.

[…]

John: Will you be doing any concerts while you’re staying - while you’re here?

Sean: [Baby noises] 

John: Yes, I thought so. You haven’t got the group together. I understand completely. 

Sean: [Baby noises] 

John: Uh, I heard you were backstage at the [Bob] Dylan concert, or was that just a rumor?

Sean: [Baby noises] 

John: An outright lie? My goodness.

[…]

John: I was wondering what it’s like being the son of such astoundingly famous, beautiful, and talented parents as John and Yoko? I wonder what it’s like… 

Sean: [Baby noises]

John: Oh, I see. I mean, could you - could you give me — 

Sean: [Slight cry]

John: Ah, mhmm, yes - more full… background into that?

Sean: [Baby noises] 

John: I see you’re very fascinated by this - this black box that I’m interviewing you with - this tape recorder. In fact, it seems to inhibit you a little bit. I mean, are you conscious - or self-conscious about the tape recorder?

Sean: [Baby noises] 

John: Well, he’s turned his head away because he got very paranoid [laugh]. It’s alright, you know. Just think of it as a very dark relative.

[…]

John: Elton! What about Elton [John]? He’s your godfather!

Sean: [Fussy baby noises]

John: Do you want to tell me how it is to have such a famous godfather?

Sean: [Begins to cry]

John: Well, I know you haven’t been able to see him yet. That’s because he can’t come into the country until January!

Sean: [Continues to cry]

John: Well, let’s just get him on the phone. Get his ass over here.

Sean: [Fussy baby noises]

John: Well, I think at that point we’ve left the interviewee because he obviously was getting violent at the thought of not seeing Dean Martin and all those people in their prime, as it were.

There are 4 kinds of people in this world:

1. Those who focus and succeed:

2. Those who get it wrong but won’t quit trying:

3. Those who have a natural talent:

4. And me: