Ohhh. I See, You Were Talking About The Initial Accusation Of Why He Got The Shackle My Bad. It Gets

Weibaybay

I’m re-reading book 6.

*deep breaths*

I’m not prepared. But I’m doing it anyways.

Expounding a little on why Jun Wu is obviously a demonic cultivator since my last post just dropped it in without backup and tgcf tap dances around what Jun Wu was doing with the kiln… It says it plainly without actually saying it.

Starting at the the low hanging fruit, Jun Wu’ first sacrifice:

“He set up a ritual site near the Kiln, and I accompanied him there every time, both of us enduring the curses and thrown rocks of the refugees as we conducted services to try to suppress the volcano’s fury.”

“Conducted services” lmao.. fancy way of saying “ritual sacrifice.” and “enduring the curses and thrown rocks” is nice way of saying “against their will”

“…but an infinite darkness is suppressed deep within his heart. Resentment, pain, anger, hatred…he must release those poisonous emotions to maintain his internal balance, lest he go berserk and slaughter everyone around him.”

Yeah um.. you say that like it’s a regular Tuesday therapy session, but it sounds a lot like ‘how to avoid yin-poisoning’

“He regularly releases his dark emotions into the Kiln, using the millions of Wuyong souls within as kindling to stoke the flames of hell and forge many malicious things..”

Oh ok. So he’s practicing his hand at twisting the souls of the dead. Nbd- wait. What?

“…Supremes came later, since he…changed the refining method…”

By.. “changed the refining method” you mean “perfected soul corruption”.. right? The way you say it is a bit umm-

“…In the early days, he’d have a session every few years, and each time the results would be different—endless batches of dark beings poured from its depths.”

✋ MNQ, please stop. That’s.. worse than demonic cultivation-

“Perhaps that had something to do with his unstable emotions-”

No. Shut up. This isn’t about Jun Wu’s feelings.

“…it produced nothing but monsters forged from his hatred and resentment. There are probably a few familiar names among them—”

It produced monsters because he was there to produce monsters. wtf are you on? I’m leaving.

And this is without getting into how he rearranged Heaven, the fact that the shackles aren’t a function of heaven but something dark and parasitic, what the heavenly capitol actually is etc etc etc.

This isn’t even a “theory” fam. This is the book.

I don't mind at all!

From my understanding, the word "ascend" is only used for the first heavenly tribulation. Ascend is step 1. After that you have your "2nd tribulation" or your "3rd" etc. So when they say "He ascended again?!" in reference to Xie Lian, they are not thinking "He's had a third tribulation?" because that means something else. The tribulations following ascension bring more power once passed. The ascension (basically) just opens the doors to heaven and welcomes you to a new power source.

And this is perf because we have the receipts now:

"For example, a heavenly official who managed horses was likely quite comfortable in their position. People always needed reliable transportation, and they couldn’t very well leave the condition of their horses and carriages to the whims of fate; who wouldn’t want their horses to be strong and healthy, and their travels safe? Thus, this sort of heavenly official would always see regular devotion. "However, what if one day mortals discovered something completely novel that ran faster than a horse? When this new invention inevitably overtook horses, worshippers of the heavenly official who presided over horses would decrease in turn. Heavenly officials such as these made up most of the heavens, blinking to life and flashing by like shooting stars. "This was the cruelest way gods declined because the process could not be reversed. A heavenly official in that situation was destined to watch their own decline until they disappeared entirely—unless they jumped down from the heavens, returned to being mortal, re-cultivated a new path, and then ascended once more as a brand-new god. Not everyone possessed the courage and fortune to do something like that."

Vol.5 Ch.79 7s

I really feel like this is pretty cut and dry in terms of explaining what happens to gods who have 0 believers left. They will die if they don't figure out a way to ascend again. And when they do, it will be their new first ascension.

What I love that you brought into the discussion is the reincarnation. That is a part of tgcf I hadn't paid much attention to and how it ties in. I'll be looking out for it

Editing: oh shoot I totally forgot to address MNQ. That's a loaded topic, but to keep it short, MNQ is "other" and he honestly sketches me out. He is the Birth of Old Age, Sickness, and Death. I have my own theories on that but this isn't the place lmaoo. (His pals are stuck on Jun Wu's face yet their bodies still became independent, sentient, mountain spirits. That's some next level shit.)

Since the shackles were man-made and not part of heaven.. then Xie Lian didn’t ascend 3 times, he went through 3 heavenly tribulations.

And he did the last one in his sleep and had the nerve to describe it as “having weird dreams.”

Legendary.

Wei Wuxian flute battle soundtrack when? I need that haunting, heart pounding donghua music 🥺 no dialogue, zombie moans dimmed, just straight up spectral rage and melody and battle beats.

I swear if I could blast that while cleaning, laundry would become a moral reckoning. Mopping? A battle for the soul of my household. Dishes? Consider them exorcised.

Some beautiful soul out there did the thing 🥹

Pure Donghua Battle Beats «— YouTube link to Yiling Patriarch shredding it on the ghost flute. 15 mins of unadulterated spook that only gets more intense as it goes.

ALSO. I’d like to say I think it’s a crime that the donghua flutist didn’t get credit. I could not find any information about who the actual musician was. However Qiu Niu who did the audio drama flute sounds a lot like the donghua flute so imma just put that out there.

And it’s a further crime they didn’t put the flute in the ost

Wei Wuxian flute battle soundtrack when? I need that haunting, heart pounding donghua music 🥺 no dialogue, zombie moans dimmed, just straight up spectral rage and melody and battle beats.

I swear if I could blast that while cleaning, laundry would become a moral reckoning. Mopping? A battle for the soul of my household. Dishes? Consider them exorcised.

Ppl out here doin’ mental gymnastics to make Jun Wu seem more palatable 👀 I’m sorry bro but he is actually not just a MisunderstoodSadboi™

He is a monster incarnate.

Xie Lian cutting loose is probably my favorite thing

Xie Lian: “Someone like Mu Qing… Even though he’s petty, narrow-minded, overly sensitive, paranoid, has a bad personality, is prone to fixating on the little things, never says anything pleasant, likes to nag, is always offending others and has garnered a lot of dislike on that account, has no friends, and remembers small, unimportant offenses for far too long…”

Fu Yao: “…”

Xie Lian: went on and on with a straight face, all in a single breath. He concluded with “…I’ve known him since we were young. He’s still got principles.”

Fu Yao: “…”

Xie Lian: “He might spit in the cup of someone he doesn’t like, but he would never poison the water,” Xie Lian continued.

Fu Yao: “…”

Hua Cheng: “Really? That’s still gross, though,”

Fu Yao: Veins were popping on [his] forehead. “No! He would never spit either!”

Xie Lian: “Laxatives, then,”

—Vol.5 Ch.51

I haven’t read the revised version yet, but sounds like mxtx is spelling a lot of things out that were left to the readers to put together. This is both great and kinda sad (sad because I love puzzles lol) but yeah the prayer thing, I had already guessed it was Jun Wu who stopped them but are you implying that Mu Qing and Feng Xin, as retainers, knew? I had not considered that, and thought their surprise was genuine. When I read again, or start the revised version, I’ll pay attention.

Even if that isn’t what you meant to imply, I still find the idea worth exploring. It’s a kernel. A seed. “For his own good.” And then before they realize, a whole wall of secrets is already between them and they’ve taken the first step away.

[Aside. The drought. We know Rain Master was freshly ascended when Xie Lian seeks her out for the Spiritual Device. Which means the drought is likely due to there being no Rain Master at the time and the newly ascended one being too weak to help. We also find out towards the end that replacing the Rai master isn’t something Jun Wu wants to do since the position is too important and the current RM doesn’t have “big ideas” so I wonder what happened to the last RM. They wouldn’t have faded naturally, which means technically Jun Wu caused the drought even if it wasn’t just to fk with Xie Lian]

As for the bell and palace, I’m not sure! I’m leaning more towards cosmic irony than a deliberate action. Or even just literary symbology. I wouldn’t count out the possibility that it was a deliberate provocation though, since the result was that Mu Qing and Feng Xin are immediately hostile. (However, Jun Wu telling Xie Lian that FX paid the bill but shh don’t tell was definitely meant to shame XL)

The second and third ascensions were definitely unplanned and completely natural, as far I’m concerned. The first one is fishy but not impossible.

He never wanted Xie Lian to have hope. He himself couldn’t even ascend a second time and if he actually did, it was centuries after his first fall. How mortifying and rage inducing for a man like Jun Wu.

But unlike Jun Wu who lost most his believers then completely eradicated the remaining, Xie Lian always had a believer and it was a Grand Believer of the rarest kind. One that Jun Wu thought he had just watch die. So he was definitely pissed.

Just my thoughts. I appreciate your thoughtful reply and love discussing/exploring tgcf. Always a pleasure

Mu Qing and Feng Xins overall immaturity, petty passive-aggression, and lack of personal growth over an 800 year span always blew my mind. But I’m starting to really consider that they had someone whispering in their ears about one another.

“Don’t mind him, Mu Qing. You know he always looked down on you and it’s only got worse since you left his highnesses side first. Feng Xin will never let that go.”

And vise-versa. Or even more insidiously, casually playing one another’s insecurities off each other in seemingly unrelated ways.

We all know Jun Wu love psychological games. Immortalizing everyone around Xie Lian not only physically but keeping them all emotionally stunted. (CoughLQQcoughcough)

And this also further serves to isolate Xie Lian, since if the three of them were able to co-exist then they could present a problem and possibly figure things out faster.

Too bad none of them could tread their own paths.

This is all just

Pure Speculation

Hua Cheng is Actually a God.

Just because he rejected heaven, doesn’t mean he rejected godhood. What he rejected was Jun Wu’s reign. And since he never gave that psycho a chance to shackle him, he couldn’t be considered anything less than a god. He passed the heavenly tribulation.

His first few believers were the people he sacrificed his eyeball for. Then, his first order of business was to slap 33 gods out of their posts and nab their followers. 2 birds, one stone.. or.. 33 birds?

The reason Jun Wu left him alone was probs not only because of his power (this dude was a Supreme Ghost King and an actual fricken God) but because Hua Cheng knew heaven was a scam. Hua Cheng was walking proof that Jun Wu was a fraud. Proof that Jun Wu’s “laws” weren’t divine laws.

What god was he? God of Luck, probably. Seems legit that the cosmic order would see fit to add a God of Luck since a God of Misfortune suddenly manifested due to belief

Speculative: You have to worship the God of Luck and the God of Misfortune together since if you only pray to the god of luck he won’t listen, and if you only pray to the god of misfortune.. well.. results may vary.