Something I Noticed In The Confession Is That They Don't REALLY Respond To What The Other Is Saying

And here it is, the key point (well, okay, one of the key points) - Aziraphale really cannot abandon the idea that Crowley's goodness is an unextinguished spark that he has retained from his times as an angel. Therefore, if Crowley were to be reinstated in Heaven, it would bring him back his long lost integrity and "fullness of joy" (as in the Bible, yes). He knows perfectly well that Crowley is unhappy and has never been happy in all these 6000 years. Of course, he cannot help but want to "put everything back the way it was". And he can't/doesn't understand that for Crowley this is simply not an option.

On understanding and other things

I think part of the reason why that final talk is so painful is because it shows that they don't know each other as well as they wanted to believe. Both of their ideas about who the other is and what they want are based mostly on what they want the other to be and not on who they really are.

They both want to be together, but in different ways. Aziraphale wants them to be on the same side, on the side of heaven. Crowley wants them to be on their own side, one apart from heaven and hell and everything they know, one where they can be themselves as Crowley and Aziraphale, not as angel and demon or even angel and angel.

And I think the reason they want such different things has to do with a number of things that could be summed up in their different life experiences and, consequently, their views on idealism and big changes.

Aziraphale never got over who they were in the beginning. I think for both of them that might have been one of the most beautiful moments of their lives, because they were still together, on the same side, simply in awe of the beauty of creation and unaware of the problems that would arise in the future. It is the only part of their history where they could be on the same side without breaking the rules, so it is only natural that Aziraphale remembers it as the best of times. But it ended with Crowley being unfairly cast out, so it's only sensible that he has a completely different perception.

And Aziraphale still believes Crowley to be an angel. He interprets his rejection of evil and his pursuit of goodness as a remnant of the angel he used to be and his desire to be one again. And actually, this interpretation makes sense, but it’s just not the correct one. Crowley has again and again denied his demon nature, doing everything in his power to do as little evil as possible without his head office noticing, yes, but not because he wants to be an angel.

Crowley has given up the idea of heaven as fundamentally good a long time ago, as it has proven, in more than one ocassion, to be capable of as much cruelty as hell itself in the name of an imagined greater good. Crowley's experience as an angel was good only at the very beginning. Once he learned that heaven was more about following rules than doing good, his idea of it was lost.

In short, Crowley doesn't want to be a demon any more than he wants to be an angel. It is not a matter of which side, but of the existence of sides per se. He does not like the system and does not want to be part of it from either side.

That is why he is hurt, because after so long, Aziraphale misunderstood his true nature. Crowley wants to be good, yes, but not in an angelic way. He doesn't want to go back to the place where rules and great plans matter more than real goodness. He just wants to be himself, outside of preconceived ideas of good and evil.

And so Aziraphale's offer to return to all that comes to Crowley as a disappointment. To realise that after all these years the one person you can consider a friend doesn't really understand you, the one person who has stood by you, listened to you, protected you, and done everything that no one else ever did. That even that person can't understand what you are, well, it must have felt like a stab in the chest.

And the same is true the other way around.

Crowley wanted to think that after the events of s1, Aziraphale had finally accepted who he was and what he (they) wanted. In the same way that Crowley hasn't been good at being a demon, Aziraphale hasn't been good at being an angel, and Crowley thinks that puts them in the same place. But it doesn't, because although Aziraphale is not just a clueless angel who silently follows the rules, neither has he been let down in the same way that Crowley has.

As I mentioned earlier, their difference of opinion is based (not entirely, but largely) on their different experiences of heaven. Aziraphale has been let down by heaven a couple of times throughout history, but none of them could match what Crowley had to go through when he was cast out. Aziraphale knows this, but he can never truly understand it.

So even when they both understand that heaven is not ideal, one of them approaches it with exasperating idealism, while the other doesn't even try anymore.

crowley and his golden nail polish

How are we all feeling about Aziraphale’s last “I forgive you”? Does it mean I forgive you for kissing me to try to get me to stay, I forgive you for choosing this moment to reveal your feelings, I forgive you for not coming with me, I forgive you for kissing me period??? What?

I keep going back and forth on it and I NEED to hear what everyone else is thinking. Lay it on me, I’m open to new interpretations because everything hurts and I’m dying.

The last panel is truly frightening!

Keep it up @neil-gaiman, it will be over soon

😟 Who's Really the Sorriest Doctor?

When we think of an apologetic Doctor, the 10th Doctor immediately leaps to mind. But is he really the most apologetic incarnation? Here's a number crunch of all the times the Doctor has apologised ...

These are from televised episodes/telemovie only, using keywords like 'sorry,' 'apologise,' and 'apology.' Retracted apologies or those used for clarification haven't been included. Episodes counted in serials for classic era. And of course, there's not guarantee how many of these were genuine apologies ...

Key Observations

Most Apologetic Doctor (By Average): The 15th Doctor takes the crown with a whopping 4.67 apologies per episode. Though, given his short stint so far, there's still plenty of time for that to change.

The Usual Suspects: The 10th Doctor, unsurprisingly, ranks high with 2.79 apologies per episode. But the 11th and 13th Doctors nudge him aside with averages of 3.09 and 3.16, respectively.

Not So Sorry?: The 1st Doctor had a measly 0.70 apologies per episode. Grumpy and not in the least bit sorry about it.

The Rise of Remorse: There's a clear trend of increasing apologies as we move through the modern era. Recent incarnations (10th, 11th, 12th, 13th, 14th, and 15th) seem to be getting more in touch with their feelings.

The Sorriest of Them All: The Tenth Doctor might not be the sorriest on average, but with 145 total apologies, he's got the highest raw number of sorries.

Companion-Driven Apologies: Some Doctors apologise more depending on their companions. For instance, the 12th Doctor's high apology rate coincided with Clara and less so for Bill.

If you like data, you'll like this.

Whoniverse Facts for Friday by GIL

Any purple text is educated guesswork or theoretical. More content ... →📫Got a question? | 📚Complete list of Q+A and factoids →😆Jokes |🩻Biology |🗨️Language |🕰️Throwbacks |🤓Facts →🫀Gallifreyan Anatomy and Physiology Guide (pending) →⚕️Gallifreyan Emergency Medicine Guides →📝Source list (WIP) →📜Masterpost If you're finding your happy place in this part of the internet, feel free to buy a coffee to help keep our exhausted human conscious. She works full-time in medicine and is so very tired 😴

I'm not really getting the Aziraphale hate because even without all the pressures of religious brainwashing etc etc we've literally just seen through his eyes:

- Crowley radiating joy at the sheer wonder of the universe only to be crushed by orders from up high

- Those orders being the ONLY reason Crowley fell. Aziraphale knows (and has always known) that Crowley fell simply because no one wanted to listen to his ideas.

- 6000 of Crowley clearly aching to do good in defiance of his own nature

- Crowley admitting how desperately lonely that defiance is for him

- Crowley being BETTER than Aziraphale at morality and making Aziraphale better as a result

- Evidence that no one is ever going to be chill with Angel/Demon relationships unless they are too powerful to be stopped and/or willing to vanish

- That they are never going to escape the monitoring of heaven/hell (they literally were *stalked* by both sides the entire season) so they can't just live unnoticed among humans

- Even during their last few years of 'freedom' Crowley has still been desperately unhappy. He's at the 'what's the point of it all???' stage BEFORE anything bad happens in S2. For all he talks about the preciousness of their life, Crowley is radiating misery during his freedom whereas Aziraphale actually seems happy.

Like why WOULDN'T Aziraphale see this offer as the perfect solution? Crowley can get what he always wanted - to do good without anyone stopping him, with Aziraphale helping. It can be exactly like the nebula scene forever - only this time Aziraphale can just bask in Crowley's joy.

From his pov he is sacrificing his own life on Earth for THAT.

Oof we are in the last 20% of a very angsty slow burn, kiddos.

Crowley wanted Aziraphale to see that he had saved the goats. The way he looks back, how easy it is for Aziraphale to lift the miracle, he wanted to be caught by Aziraphale. We see how well the hiding miracle worked on Gabriel, the crows bleating was more than just a tiny slip up. It was intentional.

It’s the same with how he wanted Aziraphale to say to him that he believed he would save Job’s children. He’s so desperate to be seen for who he truly is in those moments. Even with the fake tough outwardly persona, he wants to know someone has faith in his true nature. Which is kindness.

an angel and a timelord walk into a bar……..

Oh, I see. When something is gone, it keeps existing.

Doctor Who: Wild Blue Yonder (2023)

After reading so much angst and real honest-to-goodness psychological drama, I revel in the warm, light and touching stories like these. There's a Russian expression "my kind of plantain/works like a plantain", which means that some fic or headcanon is good for soothing pain and heartache. And this is exactly MY kind of plantain. I love it. Incredibly so.

The most romantic moment that Aziraphale could have imagined, it’s raining and they’re absolutely soaked, but he has his arms around Crowley’s shoulders and he’s kissing him and Crowley is kissing back and oh it’s like straight from a book!

And when they pull away just an inch and Aziraphale has a dreamy look on his face and he notices Crowley’s happy smirk and he sighs.

“Alright you can say it.”

“Vavoom!”